0000794: Tank FCS is not working properly

Notes
(0001693) VyMajoris (reporter) 2015-06-26 19:54 edited on: 2015-06-26 19:55	My suggestion is to leave tank FCS optional in such way that ACE3 can develop their own FCS to work with RHS tanks. Or to leave it optional so that the vanilla one can be used.

(0001694) Damian (reporter) 2015-06-26 20:31 edited on: 2015-06-26 20:32	It was fixed. And no, we won't do it optional, end of topic, FCS is integral part of our mod. Also take in to consideration that it's still WIP and we are continously improving how FCS work. By the way, that turret movement from 0:35 is when FCS applies lead when you track moving target, use it only when you lead target that is mobile, if not then press G to disable lead or wait when FCS will stop applying lead and turret will return to normal position.

(0001696) VyMajoris (reporter) 2015-06-26 20:54 edited on: 2015-06-26 20:55	Ok. The problem with leading is that you need to press Shift+G each time you lase a target. And there is no feedback. Back on ACE2 the leading as applied by holding the lase button on a target for one or two seconds and then the lead would be automatic applied... The rotating speed of the turret was not used to calculate the leading.

(0001697) Damian (reporter) 2015-06-27 12:40	We will actually change how the FCS is operated by user. I talked with Reyhard and options might actually be moved to GUI, then it should work fine, and thanks for idea, actually some messages poping up informing gunner what is going on is not a bad idea, I will pass this to Reyhard. As for ACE2, well it's FCS was not very realistic. In real M1 lead is always applied automatically after lase, and also turret movement is realistc, we are still working on making it more responsive and smoother, tough such work takes time.

(0001699) VyMajoris (reporter) 2015-06-27 16:59	But the thing is, it is pretty much impossible to mach the moving speed of a vehicle with your mouse. Mouse movements are jerky. Maybe if after pressing T you could press A and D to move the turret based on the target speed?

(0001700) Damian (reporter) 2015-06-27 17:16 edited on: 2015-06-27 17:30	It is possible, I tried it and I hit targets, you just need training. Also try to use joystick. And no, manual lead will only makes thing worse, besides this is unrealistic. We aim at realism, if vehicle have automatic lead then it will be automatic. In next version we will make lead dump easier. Besides this, did you ever used real vehicle FCS, in simulator for example? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q6CdxYbRjF8 [^] We based or model on real FCS as it is modeled for example in Steel Beasts Pro PE, it's not perfect yes, but far closer to reality than anything else in ArmA2 or ArmA3. https://youtu.be/mWrKcjIomKs?t=110 [^] Here is Challenger 2's day sight, it works in the same principle as M1A1SA, M1A1FEP and M1A2SEP day and thermal sights. As you can see in this moment, because FCS after lase and engagement still automatically applies lead, turret moves slihtly ahead of the sight. The thing we actually need to do, is to make turret during lead more responsive for rotation direction and speed changes, and makes better calculations that should be based on: 1) Target speed. 2) Turret rotation speed. 3) Turret rotation speed is equivalent to target speed and by so a proper lead is applied. Give us time to figure everything out, but the current model is proof of concept and good basis for further development. Actually the bigger problem is ArmA itself, for example if for vehicle, BIS would apply similiar mouse control as is in Steel Beasts Pro PE, where turret is not directly controlled by mouse but follows mouse, then applying turret speed would be more precise and realistic. Oh one more thing, I will give you a few hints. 1) When you track mobile target, track it for at least 5 seconds, track should be stable, then lase, then track for at least 5 more seconds, lead should be applied properly. Sometimes procedure might look different, 5 seconds stable track, lase, 5 seconds stable lead, lase again, fire. 2) Dump lead after each engagement with movin target. 3) Dump lead after each lase at stationary target. 4) Try more realistic tactics, do not rush on targets, sometimes slower movement is better, use so called frog leaps, if you play with friends frog leaps at lowest unit level can be performed per each tank in section or per each section in platoon. Platoon have 4 tanks, so per each section you have 2 tanks. 5) Use superior gunner optics, as we decided that for now we will include only the most modern M1 variants, so M1A1SA, M1A1FEP and M1A2SEP will have the same optics for gunner, day channel have 3x and 10x zoom, thermal channel have 3x, 6x, 13x, 25x and 50x zoom, thermal channel should be primary means of observation. M1A2SEP also have a CITV for commander with 3x, 6x, 13x, 25x and 50x zoom levels. NOTE! CITV do not have properly modeled optics yet! 6) Like in reality during combat movement try not to exceed around 45-50 kph, such speed is the limit in reality at which FCS and stabilization can work properly in all modern vehicles. Also at slower speed vehicle is more stable gunnery platform.

(0001701) VyMajoris (reporter) 2015-06-27 17:48	Roger. Also, there is a problem with the ranging as well. As in, it seems that it does not calculate height difference. But I think you got this already.

(0001702) Damian (reporter) 2015-06-27 19:08	Yeah, now laser range finder and ballistic calculations work better. Also good news, talked with Reyhard, he might have found a solution for better handling of turret during lead, we will see how it will work after tests, hopefully soon. I will also try to write some sort of manual for different tanks how to properly use their FCS.

(0001706) Bad Tankman (viewer) 2015-06-28 18:08	I cant wait for T-90A and her/his FCS :)

Issue History
Date Modified	Username	Field	Change
2015-06-26 18:22	VyMajoris	New Issue
2015-06-26 19:54	VyMajoris	Note Added: 0001693
2015-06-26 19:55	VyMajoris	Note Edited: 0001693	View Revisions
2015-06-26 20:31	Damian	Note Added: 0001694
2015-06-26 20:32	Damian	Note Edited: 0001694	View Revisions
2015-06-26 20:54	VyMajoris	Note Added: 0001696
2015-06-26 20:55	VyMajoris	Note Edited: 0001696	View Revisions
2015-06-27 12:40	Damian	Note Added: 0001697
2015-06-27 16:59	VyMajoris	Note Added: 0001699
2015-06-27 17:16	Damian	Note Added: 0001700
2015-06-27 17:30	Damian	Note Edited: 0001700	View Revisions
2015-06-27 17:48	VyMajoris	Note Added: 0001701
2015-06-27 19:08	Damian	Note Added: 0001702
2015-06-28 18:08	Bad Tankman	Note Added: 0001706
2015-09-14 01:48	Soul_Assassin	Status	new => resolved
2015-09-14 01:48	Soul_Assassin	Fixed in Version	=> 0.3.9
2015-09-14 01:48	Soul_Assassin	Resolution	open => fixed
2015-09-14 01:48	Soul_Assassin	Assigned To	=> Soul_Assassin

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